47 Comments. Add your own...

• 1. Abou Ali | November 1st, 2009 at 11:15 pm

  N,
  i fully agree with you. But, and it is a BIG but, I do not believe that Zibballah will allow it. The only solution is to CARVE a territory that will declare secession, create thus a canton, then negotiate a federation… But WE are not smart enough and do not have the guts to do it

• 2. Mike | November 1st, 2009 at 11:19 pm

  Federalism? Right. Too many sects mixed in too many places with different political stances in an all too small country. Probably turn into west and east beirut during the civil war.

• 3. THERESINIA | November 2nd, 2009 at 12:17 am

  N,

  You try to explain something intelligent (Federalism) to some people who cannot even understand neither the meaning, nor the functioning. You need first to educate them to this most civilized and succesful system that exists today.

• 4. Mike | November 2nd, 2009 at 1:31 am

  Yea, he must educate us uneducated people. Federalism is good in the US. The constitution and bill of rights are good as long as you can protect them. America is turning into a republic. So when we have a situation as complex as the one in Lebanon then the solution is we make it simple. But is federalism going to be a simple solution or a means to and end for our all too complex situation? That’s the real question and if everyone is willing to take part in it and under what guidelines. Because the way I’m seeing it; it can lead to sectarian hidden agenda in this country.

• 5. PIERRE | November 2nd, 2009 at 2:10 am

  Federalism now. It is a better model for Lebanon then what we have now. Decentralization is practicaly another word for Federalism so lets start using that word as the public is more receptive to it.

• 6. hamilkar | November 2nd, 2009 at 2:55 am

  Federalism ,a union of states under a central government distinct from that of the separate states, who retain certain individual powers under the central government. that mean for exemple that we can control at least our kids education without the interferace of Mr Fneich .

• 7. danny | November 2nd, 2009 at 3:05 am

  Mike,
  You are fevereshly pushing some absurd agenda or crap about Zionizm and Federalism not working and complicated Lebanese etc…etc… etc…Let’s present it to your hyper sensitive brain in a simple manner….

  Let’s have separate cantons ala Switserland and may I be liberal enough to say that we will give every Lebanese citizen which system they would like to live in…This craps out your insane bullshit about 2000 sects blah blah blob….Then we’ll have a solution. I guess you and your terrorist buddies with the coolaid crowd will object for the simple reason that most middle to upper class and educated as well as business people will RUN AWAY from the filthy confines of Hizbitzy land to the freeedom of democracy!!

  So spare the constant harang of nonsense! Make a movie with avi…

• 8. Mike | November 2nd, 2009 at 4:03 am

  Better yet make you the star in a kill bill type movie except having the lead character shoot avi aka judas and then shoot himself in the head. We can call it the end of zionism by lebanese productions.

• 9. danny | November 2nd, 2009 at 4:07 am

  Mike….You seem to be close to expiration date….SPOILED!!!

• 10. Mike | November 2nd, 2009 at 5:34 am

  You seem to be already be expired along with avi. Yalla rooh galle.

• 11. SmaSh | November 2nd, 2009 at 5:43 am

  before any Federalism, badkoun da3em/tajamo3 massi7e 2AWEEE.
  mich hek yallah Federalism wmichna.
  As long as you have Aoun vs Geagea, we aint going ANYWHERE and all other sects are having fun with us.

  and IF we get Federalism, who will have control on THE CHRISTIAN STATE?? Let’s be real, the Christians are GREEDY. They always want power.

  Enough with us.

  The real deal is: The other sects DO UNDERSTAND what is federalism, but they are playing ” el 2atrash” They know what we want and they are ignoring cause they want full control of Lebanon. This way they can eliminate us and take our places.

  They are already doing it by buying land.
  Ma bte2dir t2aslem el cha3eb? 2aslem el 2ard!

• 12. nectarios | November 2nd, 2009 at 6:27 am

  federalism is the least bad solution but we know it is not realistic ; one party today can take control of all the country but he intends to take control of the country gradually avoiding a civil war. Who can stop him avoiding also a civil war?

• 13. Reminder | November 2nd, 2009 at 9:02 am

  I bet that all these christians who call for a Federal state are living in christian districts, i.e Mount Lebanon, Beirut all the way to Bsharre.. They don’t live in cazaa Baalback or Akkar or Tripoli or Bint Jbeil ect ect… You have thousands of christians there who will be “deserted” there. Don’t even mention “well they can move to our areas” as if that were that easy! Don’t think about yourselves you selfish idiots! think about the thousands of christians living in more than 85% muslim districts!

  FYI if elections wer held in the “christian” state Aoun would win so from that standpoint I don’t mind having that bullshit, but its the reason mentioned above that I refuse to implment that system.

  Theresina instead of pointing out to how other people are uneducated pls let me remind you that in the three countries that have an examplary Federation (USA, Swizerland, Germany) they all have one people, or at least one religion. Differences between Hispanics and Whites is not like muslims & christians! The difference between german speaking swiss or french speaking swiss isn’t either! There aren’t minorities in each state whose rights can be violated! It is not the same as the US & the others! hamilkar mentioned controlling education, well what about the children living in muslim areas? How will their education be? Now we have a say in education (or at least a limited), within the other states we won’t at all! Wake up guys!

  And one last thing dear uneducated Theresina, you cannot turn a ALREADY UNIFIED country into a federation of states, remember that Germany was a series of COMPLETELY INDEPENDANT states (Bavaria, Prussia, Saxony, Wutenburg, Bremen ect..) before Bismark unified it under the optimal option of a federation. Same with the US it was 13 independant (from eachother, not from Britain) colonies that were unified! Belgium was two seperate entities (Wallonia and Flandern) for centuries before uniting as one! So you can go from independant states to a federation (like all the examplary countries that have this system) but not the other way around!

• 14. N10452 | November 2nd, 2009 at 10:28 am

  Reminder,
  Instead of babbling for saying nothing, go read a bit about Federalism and check some posts on the blog written by myself before and answering your same exact questions ..

  Baddak t2elle Christians living in Ras Baalbeck would mind moving to a pure Christian region and be represented and have a say instead of being ruled by HA ?

  Geography is irrelevant when it comes to a greater goal.

• 15. avi | November 2nd, 2009 at 10:46 am

  Mike you are the one expired along with your stupid movie,buy yourself a brain it could help.

• 16. Reminder | November 2nd, 2009 at 10:51 am

  N10452,
  If you own a house and piece of land, that you inherited from your father, who inherited it from his father, it goes way back in the family, its your home! can u leave it easily? if you sell that cheap house what the hell can you buy in mount leb? remember that prices in baalback and bin jbeil are much cheaper than lands in our areas, not to mention the fact that if all christians do that and start buying houses in our areas, supply is the same and demand is rising like hell, what happens to the prices genuis? would they still be able t afford it? prices are already soaring!
  From all that you read in my post you think its blab? Its facts! facts about these countries and how they becamse federations! why ruled by HA? what about sunnis in akkar and tripoli? do you think HA has the chrsitains in caves or turned their villages into police towns?
  Its not about geaography! its about attachment to your lands and family properties, and its about economics! such a shift is not only very costly on the people moving but on the macro-economic environment as well! think outside the box!
  and ma testakhre el 3alam!

• 17. ja3far | November 2nd, 2009 at 10:58 am

  and of course the lebanese are mature enough, and have great trust in each others to change homes and geography to serve” the great goal” …

  there will be no secterian war; minorities will not be slaughtered in specific places to make them ran away .. and each group or sect will be very pleased with the geographical area that his leaders agreed on while drinking tea and ” making jokes ” about hareb al jabal …

• 18. Reminder | November 2nd, 2009 at 11:37 am

  just to add to the economic problems arising from the displacement of all these people is jobs! How easy is it for all these people moving to find jobs? Those who worked in facotories or wharehouses that are not located in our areas where do they work? Can you find jobs for all these people? can they afford to buy land or apartments in our areas? Think man think!

• 19. ja3far | November 2nd, 2009 at 12:16 pm

  to make things more interesting:

  nadine in 1986 :
  youtube.com/watch?v=Xam5XQn1I0E

  nadina in 2009:

  youtube.com/watch?v=7auCWnqSknA

  nadina.tv/Nadina2007.html

  so guys .. nadine zarife.. is she christian or muslim ? ya zaman al taeifiye
  what u think khaye Paul ?

• 20. Fuziyad | November 2nd, 2009 at 12:18 pm

  N, are you talking about federalism or partition? cuz as far as am concerned federalism doesn’t solve the probs I have with HA as in federal states defense and foreign affairs are decided by the central government and this is where my disagreement is problematic…law kenna mekhtlefin on where and how we should build this or that road then yes federation might solve it…

  Ideally I would be in favor of partition but pargmatically I know it’s impossible to do so better stick to the actual system…

• 21. THERESINIA | November 2nd, 2009 at 12:30 pm

  Reminder,

  Once again, you show lots of deficiency in your knowledge; For example Switzerland is composed of – at least – 3 different populations: 1) Swiss French, 2) Swiss Germans, 3) Swiss Italians. The war lasted 101 YEARS between the Swiss French and the Swiss Germans until they created Federalism (or to be more precise CONFEDERALISM). Since then the Swiss – ALL the SWISS – have been happy and wealthy.
  Last year, 3 academics came from Switzerland to visit Lebanon and said that Lebanon would benefit most from a federal structure, and that they could see no difficulties implementing it.

  These people are experts. So please, listen to experts.

• 22. THERESINIA | November 2nd, 2009 at 12:38 pm

  Federalism is an excellent solution and could save Lebanon from all further destructions, whether political, social or economical. Three studies already exist. If we seek better future and happier life for our children, let us stop all sorts of demagogical argumentation and proceed to think and reflect towards this objective with experts in all fields.

  More than one third of the countries on this planet have a federal regime and they are doing better than the others.

• 23. Reminder | November 2nd, 2009 at 12:44 pm

  What about Belgium Germany or USA? What war are you talking about? 3am bet fayel 3aleye? tell me exactly what war are you talking about from when til when? Switzerland started its Confederacy in 1291! 700 years ago man! Plus the differences between the three types of Swiss is not as large (or the same as) the differences between Lebanese! Except for the language you can barely tell!

  A diplmat from Belguim exlained why joining seperate states is possible to form a Federation whereas dividing a state doesn’t! Hisotry explains that as well Theresina!

  So pls tell me which was were you talking about? and which country was unified and then turned into a Federation and succeeded? Give me one example cause so far I have given you 4 of the opposite!

  Oh an btw the wars you are talking about happened during the 6th century and before and were wars between the Franks and the Alamanni! (France and German states) that was not a civil war amongst Swiss and happned more than 1 fricking thousand years ago!
  Stop bullshiting because I am gonna call you on that! enough bullshit!

  What about the economic problems that I raised? how will her majesty solve that?

  The reason why ALL the SWISS live happily and are wealthy is because the last war Switzerland was involved in was back in 1815! Its neutrality and banking system caused that!

• 24. ja3far | November 2nd, 2009 at 12:56 pm

  reminder.. they want to follow the example of Iraque…

• 25. Rambo | November 2nd, 2009 at 1:31 pm

  Don’t forget to add:

  Al Jouzou to all this:

  الجوزو: ليعد الموارنة ولبنان كله الى سوريا وليس الذي اشتاق لسوريا وحده

  and

  مفتي جبل لبنان قد اعطى رأيه الواضح والصريح في المسؤولين عن هذا التنظيم حين قال عن الرجل الثاني في التنظيم ايمن الظواهري: “ان الظواهري هو طبيب ميسور، وابن لادن مليونير اختار أن يهيم بين الوديان والجبال الوعرة، والاثنان يهدفان الى ردّ الارهاب عن المسلمين، وهذا دليل قاطع على أنه ليس الفقراء فقط هم من يثورون انما الأغنياء أيضاً، الذين تهزهم الهيمنة الأميركية والوصاية على أمتنا”.

  And the poor christians still geagea vs aoun .. aoun vs geagea …. geagea vs amine … amine vs. aoun …..

  Get out of your feudal mentality or else you will be what Bachir fought against “Ahil Zimeh”

• 26. Lebanonhsh | November 2nd, 2009 at 1:59 pm

  You had your chance and you blew it..too late now for this. For sure you will now blame this and that but end of story…

• 27. SmaSh | November 2nd, 2009 at 4:40 pm

  Lebanonhsh, why wouldnt you want a federal state?

  give us an expleneation
  what will make YOU NOT benefit from it?

• 28. Reminder | November 2nd, 2009 at 5:04 pm

  why hasn’t anyone answered the questions I put forth about implementing a fededral system? who is the sheep following their leaders blindly? aren’t you following your leader’s opinion without haveing sufficient info to defend your case?

• 29. danny | November 2nd, 2009 at 5:13 pm

  Reminder,

  You are an angry man/woman…take a deep breath…

  Now; you are all over the map young buck!!
  You expressed your opinion: great. Do you want a medal?

  If people put their mind to it all things are possible. On the other hand if you’d like to use terror to achieve your purpose; well it won’t last…Read your history!

• 30. Darwish | November 2nd, 2009 at 6:18 pm

  Federalism is a good concept but for it to become reality must be a consensual decision by all parties involved, otherwise, the other option is partition a solution a la cyprus since each side will have its own laws and self governing body and will have its own orientation (Western values vs. arab/muslim values). To be honest, I do not see either option becoming a reality unless it is agreed upon or imposed internationally. In the meantime, I opt for working on the 10452 SQ KMs as bachir dreamed.

• 31. Lebanonhsh | November 2nd, 2009 at 8:33 pm

  Nb27
  how did u conclude that i don’t want a federal state?

• 32. Al (Ex-Anonymous) | November 2nd, 2009 at 8:43 pm

  all of this is very nice but can you please explain how you intend to apply federalism and what is exactly is you action plan to do it?

• 33. Patrick | November 3rd, 2009 at 12:10 am

  federalism will let liberal areas become more liberal and backward areas become more backward…. how is that a solution? isn’t it better to work for the complete disarmament of hezbollah, and then work to spread the values of secular democracy across all lebanon instead of consolidating support for these values in a few areas while abandoning the rest?

• 34. THERESINIA | November 3rd, 2009 at 1:23 am

  Reminder,

  Does the elephant fly??????

• 35. Rima | November 3rd, 2009 at 3:29 am

  N

  I support you with this one but who said HA will agree on that…I wish we can isolate HA `in the south before it is to late

• 36. Rima | November 3rd, 2009 at 3:39 am

  So the anti-federalism people on this blog…are you saying that the present sytem is working and no need for a change..by the way keep doing the same thing expecting another result is insanity!

• 37. Mike Habi | November 3rd, 2009 at 6:06 am

  Theresina 1/3 of the world are federal countries. Or only a bit more than 20? The same experts that you are talking about said they don’t understand lebanon’s economic system espicially with the dollar and lira exchange rate. But said whatever you guys are doing keep doing it. Go listen to your “experts” who say hezeballah must be disarmed so we can get our heads cut off. Or the LF should give up its weapons and then became inneffective in lebanese politics since and with dr.geagea sabotaged and thrown in jail for 11 years. So much for these experts. Do you even personally know them? Do you think they actually said that to find the optimum solution for the lebanese or what will be more affective from their point of view or even vested interests? Don’t we have enough lebanese experts who are much smarter than them that actually avoided becoming effected from the economic crisis in the world and let Lebanon’s economy rise by 5% since. Seems you don’t know jackshyt from learning from history. Only stating facts and dates but no real insight. Or the ottoman experts who let the christians of mount lebanon give up their weapons and let the druze come massacre us in 1860. Or better yet, the expert sigmund freud who says you love your mom because you were sexually attracted to her when you were young during breast feeding. So much for these “experts”; we use our own judgement on personal matters and we don’t need swiss who have a pacifist state and are indifferent to what happens in the world while not creating any affect but exchanging money of which they didn’t even understand our system here. No wonder they reccommended federalism; put the german swiss in a place and the french and italian in another, have each region based on the language and thought the same can be applied to lebanon. In essence, it wouldn’t of been a bad idea if done in the beginning of lebanon’s independance. But now? Seriously grow up; we are not ethnically cleansing areas and creating the bosnia herzegovina type state here or israel free of arabs. We love our muslim and druze brothers and we look forward to staying side by side.

• 38. Doc1559 | November 3rd, 2009 at 6:09 am

  Guys, lets stop going in circles. Between the time I was 1 and when I turned 30 Lebanon went from bad to worse and will only worsen in the near futire as long as we have the same old politicians in office w akid backed by this sectarian constitution.

  Bottom line is this, the problem of all unresolvable conflicts is the same, whether in north Lebanon, south Lebanon, jabal Lebenen and Achrafiyeh, each side suffers from a deep rooted sectarianism, each side believe that only their wound matters !!!

  You may or may not believe in that, but the solution is secularism. Otherwise, khalikun da7bo ba3ed..

  A secular Lebanon without being anti faith is what we need..

• 39. Doc1559 | November 3rd, 2009 at 6:19 am

  Rima

  The system ain’t working !! The complexity of the situation is really hard to solve. We are going in circles.. Part of the solution is dialogue, dialogue that truly takes all of us into account… 7atta 7ake ma ba2 7ada 3m ye7ke ma3 al teneh..

  balad sa2it min jami3 al nawe7e, ma ba2 twaji3i albik..

  I love the wiggles !!

• 40. Mike Habi | November 3rd, 2009 at 6:21 am

  If these idiots in office can’t even form a government. You expect them to create a federalist state?

• 41. ja3far | November 3rd, 2009 at 8:39 am

  i believe many of you guys are confused between federalism and separation …

• 42. Reminder | November 3rd, 2009 at 8:58 am

  Theresina
  Depends, if what you say can be true then yes an elephant can fly, he can do that will riding a bicycle on a rainbow as well… with LFers anything can be true and gravity can be false…

• 43. Mike | November 3rd, 2009 at 10:05 am

  Hey N. What happend to my other comment ? the long one explaining the situation in detail. Btw a secularist state is a good idea. Just like in Turkey!

• 44. Reminder | November 3rd, 2009 at 10:14 am

  Great example Mike! I wish I thought of that, was too busy trying to understand Thersina’s logic and again, what war was she talking about… But you see Mike a secularist state does not benefit them, because they can no longer scare people into voting and siding with them. 14 March chrisitians like to control their followers through fear… why would anyone follow a criminal of war/ corrupt politician / hypocrite if that homo habilis ( not eveolved enough to deserve the name homo sapien ) wasn’t offering protection? protection from a danger that doesn’t exist! that is extortion a method used by the mafia…

• 45. Mike | November 3rd, 2009 at 12:01 pm

  Listen man, you’re being too direct here in bashing il hakeem. Just because I said certain views that might align with other parties or groups, it doesn’t mean I’m not with the LF. Let’s not be too hypocritical here. If geagea is a criminal then so is jumblat and berri. I see that geagea gets the most blame due to the fact of him being christian which I also don’t like in lebanese society where some people get away with it and some don’t. Just because a person stands out of the crowd, it doesn’t mean he’s to get all the blame. Geagea made mistakes in the past and many to be exact just like every other politician and leader including sheikh bashir. Dr.Geagea has become really wise since being released from prison and he read the Quran many times there along with lots of books. But in the end of the day, the LF kind of follows the batrak and the batrak follows the vatican.I personally strongly dislike the vatican due to the fact that they are the most corrupt institution that falsely claims to represent most of christianity while contradicting their role and actually harming its followers by doing basically nothing to influence the world on a global scale. That aside, lots in the LF believe that a federalist state is needed so the Lebanese christians will still have a presence in the country. They feel that if they don’t carve out the land now and permanently and have direct control over the christian strongholds then the lebanese christians will immigrate and we will loose hold of the country. Christianity has brought much beauty to the middle east and contributed to its rich diversity. It is also the main protector of Lebanon in the past and if it wasn’t for the Maronites then we would of been part of Syria. For that reason it must be preserved. The other thing I want to point out is that we as the LF are missing adressing the main root of the problem. What is the point of cutting of a small branch but not focussing on cutting down the entire tree? The fact of the matter is whether I like it or not, it lies in Zionism. It is the single most destructive force to come to this earth and hijack the names of jews and christians. Which the vatican is working directly with and for that reason I denounce their authority or morality. Those who want to fanatically support the vatican and zionism do not actually know what they are doing. So my point is don’t hold any bias to any group or people just because they think a certain way. Instead you can get them to agree with you or even comply to terms or ideas if you show them the truth about a matter and get the reality on the problem. That’s what I’m doing here although getting attacked by many who like to protect the corrupt. Those same people are the ones who like us to think that the people who are actually protecting the 10452 are the bad guys. We are doing an awarness campaign because if the LF continues the way it’s going. It will turn into basically null.

• 46. Reminder | November 3rd, 2009 at 3:26 pm

  I agree that Jumblat is just as bad yet even worse than Geagea, so is Berri Arafat and many others.
  But he hasn’t changed at all! The cirumstances have! Before he was the leader of one of the strongest militias in Lebanon, now he is the leader of a small minority party.

• 47. Jean | November 10th, 2009 at 3:03 am

  44. Reminder | November 3rd, 2009 at 10:14 am

  and i quote, “14 March chrisitians like to control their followers through fear”. Have you heard of the expression, the pot calling the kettle black? How is this different to how HA control their followers and intimidate people that oppose them?

  Geagea is the only one that has done bad? You said, “why would anyone follow a criminal of war/ corrupt politician / hypocrite”. This is absolute nonsense. I am not going to sit here and defend every action that was undertaken by the LF, but dont make him out as the only “criminal” that we have in Lebanon. Difference between the LF and FPM is that we can disagree with Samir Geagea or any officials without being insulted. Do FPMers have that same freedom that they are so-called fighting for?

  If we are going to talk about criminals, lets do so fairly. Lets put Michel Aoun on trial for leaving his men to die whilst he fled the country. Lets put him on trial for the useless harb ilgha2. Lets put him on trial for his pathetic attempt of photoshop propaganda against the LF. That is fraud!

  You want to talk about mafia’s? Lets talk about the Hariri and Frangieh families.

  This could go on forever, my point is – dont come here and bash one person directly, when there are countless others that have done the same, and in most cases, worse!

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